Mildred Natwick: The Path of Fear
"It’s a form of thinking that we’re taught, and we have to develop a new form of thinking that pulls us up and away from the wrong thinking, the lies."
James Grissom: Tennessee [Williams] told me that he reached out to you for help. Do you remember that?
Mildred Natwick: Of course. I was so startled. I was moved.
James Grissom: What was he seeking specifically?
Mildred Natwick: Well, I don’t feel that I can share that with you. With anyone. I think that is private.
James Grissom: I respect that. Tennessee told me that you pulled him from a lie.
Mildred Natwick: I’m comfortable talking about Tennessee with you in general terms, and, yes, I felt he was caught in a…what am I thinking of? A web? In the mud?
James Grissom: Tennessee liked to talk about knots. Time knots. Health knots.
Mildred Natwick: Yes! A knot. No circulation. No movement. Look, you have your notes, which I’ve read, and Tennessee was bringing those same fears to me that he brought to you. For instance, he said he was incapable of writing, of doing the writing that he needed to do. He said he was “dried up.” And I pointed out that he was very creative, very busy. He was very busy manufacturing lies and lack and fears. All of his energy was devoted—in the time I was talking to him—to what he didn’t have, what he couldn’t do, what no one was giving to him.
James Grissom: He said you gave him a pattern. I think that was the word he used. A pattern.
Mildred Natwick: Well, what Tennessee was doing—what he was going through—is something we have all gone through. It’s a form of thinking that we’re taught, and we have to develop a new form of thinking that pulls us up and away from the wrong thinking, the lies.
Within the theatrical community—or any artistic community—there seems to be a common pattern of incorrect thinking. I’ve been guilty of it. I work every day to avoid it. Not so much anymore, because I’m older and I’m not working very often. But what I’m describing is a form of thinking that affects all of us.
James Grissom: Tell me about it.
Mildred Natwick: Well, here is the pattern or the knot as it was pointed out to me by a teacher. It a path, really. The teacher used the term pathogenesis—the pathogenesis of fear. And fear leads to anger. Here is the path:
I don’t have a job.
I don’t think I’ll ever get a job again.
Am I good enough to get or keep a job?
Who is preventing me from getting a job? Did I anger someone?
I deserve to have a job. Why is X working and I’m not?
I hate X. I bet she’s been given favors. She’s cheating in some way.
I’m going to ask around about X. I’ll get to the bottom of this.
I hate this business. I hate life.
How can I fix this? To whom can I talk?
Why do I even bother?
Now, what I just told you—and I would like to see the notes, to make sure I got it correctly—was given to me by a teacher. A practitioner. I want to be sure I have her teaching correctly. But you can see the path here, and the bad place to which it leads you. I told Tennessee that he was very creative; very active. Look at the ornate, complicated lies he was thinking up every day, every minute of every day! He had pulled himself into a sort of hell of his own making. Well, all of our hells are of our own making.
James Grissom: Tennessee told me that he felt better after talking to you.
Mildred Natwick: I would like to think that I helped him. I hope he felt better.
James Grissom: Did he acknowledge the worth of what you had told him?
Mildred Natwick: I don’t remember that he did. I must tell you that I don’t think it was what he wanted to hear. I’ve looked at your notes from other actresses, and I’ve talked to a few of the women you’re talking to, and I think what Tennessee wanted was company. He wanted attention. Well, I would not have been doing him any favors by giving him time and attention toward a lie. A series of lies. I kept trying to move him away from how he was thinking, and he wanted a specific kind of comfort. He wanted me to tell him he was right, you see. That’s what most people are seeking. Tell me I’m right. In my anger. In my fear. In my pursuit of whatever it is I think I lack.
James Grissom: That is true. Maureen Stapleton said he wanted to be “cuddled in his pain.”
Mildred Natwick: That’s it. But we are all guilty of that. Look, I don’t feel that I—or anyone—can judge anyone who comes before us with a need. We don’t judge the need first: We offer help, in whatever way we can. My first impulse was not to tell Tennessee about the bad path he was on. My first impulse was to be loving, which I consider a requirement. But when Tennessee asked me what he thought he should do, I began to talk about fear—the lie of fear—and how he had to move away from it. But fear, no matter how much damage it does to us, is comfortable. We recognize it. And people look at you as if you’re mad when you tell them that fear is a lie. It’s a self-created lie that does you great damage. And I think that’s why Tennessee moved away from me.
James Grissom: You feel that he did?
Mildred Natwick: Yes. The calls stopped. He was always kind when he saw me. He came to see me in a play. I went to see his play—I think his last play—that was done here. It was always sweet to see him. He would complain a bit, in a funny way, but I felt he would have loved to sneak away and go back into his complaints.
James Grissom: Have you been accused of being unrealistic?
Mildred Natwick: Oh, yes!
James Grissom: Ruth Gordon told me that I might not initially believe that you were real, but that you are.
Mildred Natwick: Yes. Ruth told me that. You know, Ruth was very good friends with Edith Evans, who was very helpful to me several times.
James Grissom: I know you’ve asked me to limit discussion of Christian Science…
Mildred Natwick: …yes, but not because I am ashamed of it. Christian Science saved my life, and I am devoted to it, but so many people have a complicated idea of it. I mean, once people learn that I’m a Christian Scientist, it’s all they want to talk about. People don’t ask Helen Hayes only about being a Catholic. People are fearful of Christian Science because Christian Science—in my life—goes right after those comfortable fears we think we need, and which we think are true. I was on a set once and an actor learned I was a Christian Scientist, and he pinched me very hard on my arm, to see if I felt pain. When I reacted, he said, See, you couldn’t deny that, could you? A total misunderstanding of the teachings. For me, it has been a re-education of my thinking on fear, which is the basis for everything. From fear comes lack and anger and every bad choice we could possibly make.
Look, the final thing I remember saying to Tennessee was that I wanted him to get on a good path, and I would help him in any way I could. I offered him my advice, from my experience, and I told him I would be there whenever he needed me. But he chose another way.
This interview took place in Mildred Natwick’s apartment at 1001 Park Avenue in 1990.